Hi gdz,

Well Valencia down to Benidorm is a good area for wintering with some nice daytime temperatures (while the sun is out - it gets pretty cool when it goes back in and at night). There are loads of stopovers on here which you have access to as a subscriber eg

A couple of Aires in that area of note are the ones at Denia and Calpe These are both well equipped and located for lengthy stays.

As for crime Spain is no worse than many countries (including the UK!), you should be security minded that's all. Don't leave expensive stuff on display and keep your money and documents safe at all times etc etc.

With regard to travelling down through France, we've done this very many times and regard the journey as part of the trip taking time to enjoy the country and its fantastic Aires facilities enroute, again there are loads of stopovers listed on Club Motorhome to help you

Aires are great value too, on our latest trip up through France we spent about 6€ in three weeks on parking charges and nothing at all on water supplies, waste facilities and even electricity at a few of them was free!

Hi gdz

We'v'e not overwintered in Spain but have been there til about 20th December and still swimming in the sea at Calpe.

Back in March and much warmer than the UK but no swimming!!

The area around Javea/Calpe/Benidorm is a very popular place for overwintering for the Germans/Dutch/French/British because of the climate. It can get windy but overall the climate is very mild.

As far as travelling through France and crime - we've done the journey to Spain about 6 times (mere novices)and never had any problems but we are very security conscious and like Neil says "Dont leave expensive stuff on display". It's really commonsense - if you don't like the feel of a place, trust your instincts and move on. There are plenty of good stopovers/aires in France. Have a look at our stopovers.
We've got a dog and a good alarm so feel safer with these but to be honest have never felt unsafe or threatened.

Hope this helps

Chris

Be aware that you will see lots of lorries parked on large areas of tarmac with a nearby cafe or bar, as you travel through France. Not Aires as such but tempting to use.

The scenario goes something like this:-

Your British so you nip into the adjoining Cafe/Bar to ask if it's OK

You order your coffee or beer from the Barman/woman and politely ask if it's OK to rest overnight on the car park.

Whilst his back is turned to you he adds a little something to your drink to help you get a good nights sleep!

When you retire for the night he rings one of his friends and mentions in passing that the occupants of a camper on the car park should be getting a good nights sleep tonight.

They wake with a headache in the morning with a broken door lock and various valuables missing, convinced they have been gassed!!

Moral of the story do not eat or drink from cafe/bars at the places you overnight at.

Hi we will be going to spain in jan for the winter and need a site next to Santander has arrival at 17.30 if some one can help thanks.Going on to Almafra / Maral costa Blanca /and La manga /90 days in all.john bren :welcome1:

Hope you are not booked with Brittany Ferries Click Here

Thanks for that, if i have to drive to the sun i drive, thats the grate thing about motor- homes, but hope it,s over by jan next, but thanks again John Bren. (keep it coming)

Be aware that you will see lots of lorries parked on large areas of tarmac with a nearby cafe or bar, as you travel through France. Not Aires as such but tempting to use.

The scenario goes something like this:-

Your British so you nip into the adjoining Cafe/Bar to ask if it's OK

You order your coffee or beer from the Barman/woman and politely ask if it's OK to rest overnight on the car park.

Whilst his back is turned to you he adds a little something to your drink to help you get a good nights sleep!

When you retire for the night he rings one of his friends and mentions in passing that the occupants of a camper on the car park should be getting a good nights sleep tonight.

They wake with a headache in the morning with a broken door lock and various valuables missing, convinced they have been gassed!!

Moral of the story do not eat or drink from cafe/bars at the places you overnight at.

Just trawling through some of the post on the site and saw your post above. Do you have any direct evidence this has happened ?

Well as I see it there are a few possibilities.
1. Insurance fiddles
2. Controlled dose of Noxious substance administered based on body weight. This was contained in the reply from the head of the Society for Anesthetists when another forum, MHF covered this in depth several years ago. They also said, from memory, that if someone could invent a substance such as the gas described by those who had been robbed then it would be worth far more, than the value, that the robbers could gain from using it on Motorhomers.
I realise that some may drink themselves into a stupor but many of the people who have been Robbed do not fall into this category.
So faced with the problem of how to administer a controlled dose of drugs I extrapolated from the known facts and offer an explanation based on how we have used these lorry/cafe parking places.
Open to other suggestions as to how when parked up for the night a measured dose could be administered !!

Thank you. I like you think some of these incidents are insurance fiddles and I certainly think the gassing reports are nonsense, possibly people THINK they might have been gassed as they can offer no other explanation for someone being able to enter the motorhome and steal from it without disturbing them. None seem to mention a long tiring drive and a couple of empty wine bottles, an open widow or unlocked door. Many do mention a valuable camera and wallet packed full with totally stupid amounts of cash.

I doubt very much that there are bar/cafe proprietors who obtain drugs to slip in peoples drinks, follow them outside later to identify which motorhome they are in and then phone an accomplice to do the deed, or even do it themselves. But of course, anything is possible in theory. However I think to warn travellers that this scenario is what is actually happening would be wrong and scaremongering.

I now confess to a story about myself. Many years ago my wife and I stayed in a small hotel in Greece with some friends. One night we had a lot to drink, I mean a LOT then went to bed. I had earlier changed sone travellers cheques at the bar, and in the morning I awoke to find my wallet and money gone from the bedside table in our room. We had gone to sleep with the french windows slightly open (ground floor) we were not disturbed in the night at all.

On going for breakfast we reported the matter to the hotel proprietor who was not too helpful but later that day we noticed that the son of the establishment had bought some new accessories and was fitting them to his motorcycle. I and my friend reported what had happened to the local police who accompanied us back to the hotel, a search of the sons room revealed my empty wallet, hidden in a wardrobe, so it was obvious what had happened.

We were not gassed, our drinks were not spiked, we had enjoyed a long hot day in the sun, lots to eat and far to much to drink. Thats all there was to it.

The moral of my story is "Keep you wits about you and don't invite trouble".

Was not intending to scaremonger, just make people aware of the possibility of trusting strangers who have access to things you intend to ingest. It only needs a couple of powdered sleeping pills to achieve the desired result. It may not be the owner/proprietor who is on the late shift, just someone who relishes the chance of some easy money with little or no risk.
Easy one for the police to check just need to match up phone calls on times and days of events.

hi just reading about gas attacks in vans etc I was never a
great believer until a few days ago when a friend of mine who
has a touring caravan on a site in Benidorm and have been wintering there a good few years.They were gassed and robbed
along with 4 other vans on the same night.All lost similar
things cash cards computers having said that 14 were arrested
for similar crimes a few days after just hope they were same gang

What first hand EVIDENCE is there that gas or anything g else was used please?

thanks iandsm for your interest your question was what's evidence that they used gas. he's still got the dent in his head where the gas bottle hit him

cheers gdz

Hi we will be going to spain in jan for the winter and need a site next to Santander has arrival at 17.30 if some one can help thanks.Going on to Almafra / Maral costa Blanca /and La manga /90 days in all.john bren :welcome1:

Hi John, have you seen this one just inland from Santander?

Might be useful :thumbs:

Hi Neilmac
I got mayself a Snooper sat nav, and this is one on it but im heading for Lierganes(Paseo De Velasco)15Mils out side of Santander next to the station. :thumbs: Thats if im not gas by then.(ha.ha .ha ) :laugh: John Brenda

Like it :thumbs: :laugh:

Gassing nonsense... explain this then !!!, We were in our race (Bike Racers)truck 32ft long (1/2 of this is garage and store area) and stopped at a Motorway services near Barcelona stupidly we parked away from the trucks due to the noise from the refrigerated units and parked up away at the bottom away from everybody, we had Ate from our own fridge around 9pm the food from Morrisons in Gibralter, Stopped at 1 am and we all set our alarms for 7 am to get an early start, Apart from my 8 year old son (who had a mcdonalds) the others were fit young men.
The first i knew in the morning was a panic in the truck as we had all slept in... 10am , Tried to get out the habitation door however it had been crow barred and was jammed, We went out through the cab doors to find robbers had chiselled through the drivers door skin but failed to open, They then chiseled through the passenger cab door and gained access that way, the truck was ransacked they obviously crawled over some of the guys who were asleep to get money cameras phones etc, Also massive noise would have been created with the hammer and chisel through the doors, WE had a major panic when we could not waken my 8 year old son it took him two days before he was well again.The gaurdia cival said it was a common problem with gysies gassing RVs, So please accept my apologies but dont dare suggest gassing is nonsense... we were gassed...END

An awful experience for you all, I hope you soon can put it behind you and start to enjoy yourselves again. Incidentally, this is the first report I have read from an individual who was the actual victim, as opposed to it being a second or third hand story.

Out of interest, did you later find anything to suggest how something might have been introduced, did anyone notice any lingering smell etc etc.

Did the police mention "gassing" I mean some sort of gas in a container or perhaps just running their vehicle exhaust pipe to you unit. Highly dangerous and I am only speculating, but could have the desired effect and your 8 yr old may have suffered a longer lasting carbon monoxide poisoning given that being smaller his lung capacity is less than adults and therefore the noxious gas would have greater effect.

Hello and thanks for your concern, This happened a few years ago,When we woke we all felt as though we had a major hangover, There did not appear to be any smell .. however i remember we were all glad to get outside and breath fresh air as there was a musty sort of smell in the habitation area. There were no lasting effects on my young son, The police say that the gypsies use some sort of industrial gas that is supplied in a gas bottle type container, apparently this was fed through the fridge vent or any vent they can access, How they can work out how much to release into the vehicle ... i have no idea but must be extremely dangerous, The Police said at the time it was common around that area. WE were gassed and no doubt about it.

You were certainly very lucky as well as being unlucky. It is remarcable that there are no reported deaths from these incidents of vehicle theft and this was the point that was picked up by the Royal Society for Anesthetists. As I am sure you are aware during operations when you are rendered unconscious the Anesthetist is on hand throughout to closely monitor and adjust the dose to ensure that you do not enter into eternal sleep mode. I am old enough to remember when dentists used to administer Nitrous oxide, commonly known as laughing gas when they extracted teeth. They were prohibited from doing this after several patients died in the chair and nowdays they too must have an Anesthetist present.
You may also remember an incident some years back when the Russian special forces used gas to storm an embassy to rescue some hostages. They killed several hostages with the gas intended to knock out the terrorist group.
So the method used on your group remains a mystery.

Just looked up the Russian Siege it was 2002 and the reports said all but a few of the 129 hostages died from the knockout gas that was used by Special Forces. see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_theater_hostage_crisis
My point here is if the Russian Special Forces have not got it and the Royal College of Anesthetist think it does not exist, where are the Spanish toe rags able to obtain it. Another explanation must exist, but what?

Just looked up the Russian Siege it was 2002 and the reports said all but a few of the 129 hostages died from the knockout gas that was used by Special Forces. see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_theater_hostage_crisis
My point here is if the Russian Special Forces have not got it and the Royal College of Anesthetist think it does not exist, where are the Spanish toe rags able to obtain it. Another explanation must exist, but what?

The victim is convinced they were gassed and I do not contradict his belief. But with what, and as you rightly say, where do Spanish gypsies get it and is it so cheap it's economic to use it. How is it transported, since a lot would be needed to contaminate the atmosphere in a motorhome/caravan. Personally, until someone comes up with EVIDENCE that some sort of noxious gas was used on them, I prefer not to form an opinion. However, I have to say I do not have any fear of being gassed myself.

Hi Well im off to spain for the winter in a week or two , been look forward to it but all this about gasing is a bit offputing :blush: .I have not told the wife as she will not go if i say all this is going on. :sick: SO if rubish is being put out by some motor homes just get a life :thumbs: .Now how about some good news sun sun sun. :welcome2: see you if your in spain from jan till april. Thanks for looking john bren :

All these gassing stories ...shoot me now.....I read quite regularly in local papers here about gypsies/Romanians etc being caught by the Guardia scamming mainly foreign motorist on the A7 and other main roads and there are lists of items retrieved ,wallets,passports,money,computors, documents etc but never has a gas bottle or gas cannisters been mentioned why.
And why is it only in Spain that this happens (no doubt somebody will correct me here).
This subject has been done to death on other forums with a concensus is its not possible to gas a well ventilated van.


So dont worry and enjoy your Spanish trip

PS Just noticed my avatar on here doesnt say where I am..Well Ive been in Spain for 13 years 8 with a campervan

Brian

Hi Well im off to spain for the winter in a week or two , been look forward to it but all this about gasing is a bit offputing :blush: .I have not told the wife as she will not go if i say all this is going on. :sick: SO if rubish is being put out by some motor homes just get a life :thumbs: .Now how about some good news sun sun sun. :welcome2: see you if your in spain from jan till april. Thanks for looking john bren :

John, these reports of 'gassing' and robberies have be considered in perspective. The chances of either are very, very tiny!

Normal precautions like not staying overnight at service areas (use Aires, there's enough of them - and no pre-booking req) and don't stop for anyone other than marked police vehicles.

I have no explanation for the situation that gordon50 experienced, I certainly don't disbelieve the account but who really knows what caused the effects, carbon monoxide or some other unknown gas. Actually gypsies or just thieves full stop. Without them being caught in possession of the gas it will never be known.

A horrible situation but one that should NOT be taken as commonplace and should certainly not scare others from travelling in my humble opinion

Well i will be on my way 2 weeks time gas or no gas, may see a member down there look out for a compass castaway and say hi john B)

To johnbren60 we have been in Spain for a couple of months
and had no problems the weather has been fabulous so get your selves ready for a great time in fact it's a gas
all the best

I gas that o.k then. see you john

Hi gtz im going down to spain in a weeks time for the winter, B) Iv got a Snooper satnav, it all on that. the stop overs. (aires) campsites the lot , :thumbs: I got the 2nd edition of aires in Spain and France do not go with out it. it will see you all the way thare and back. You can get it from http://www.vicariousbooks.co.uk good motor- homeing Have a great time. :lol:
John

We are following you about 10 days later but for a shorter stay. Also have the 2nd Ed. of aires in Spain and the 4th Ed for France. We are taking the west route thro' France and finally staying at Javea. Have a good trip.

Barry

Hi we are in Spain at the moment the weather has been fantastic we called in to Javea a couple of weeks ago and went the old coast road very nice plenty of hair pin bends &
steep inclines just the job for a convoy have a nice time gdz

Thanks to all about the gassing, WE are just back after a four month break touring Spain and Portugal.. glad to say no problems with Robbers etc, WE wild camped all the time butfound we got shifted on a few times by police, We had a nice spot on the Border with Gibraltar a with around another 30 odd motorhomes but we all got shifted one night , We found that the Algarve area is now better organised and the coincils have stared a few Aires costing only 4 Euroes per night.. brill
Happy Hols to all in the Sunny South

Is there a list of these new Aires

hi thanks for your interest we got back from spain a few weeks ago after 3 months we probably did a similar route to
you and got moved on a couple of times Apparently there were
more m/homes about this year & they had got brassed off with
them according to our source If they got organized with some
aires I think it would be better because the campsites are a
joke your packed in like sardines,the toilets are usually old
and they cost about 25 euro+ elec if you don't have acsi card
we only stopped at a couple between free camping we bought
camperstop book when we got back for next time but we hope to try Portugal next time never mind the weather was fantastic and we had a great time by the way they are looking at brake cleaner as a gas or similar that they knock you out with
all the best geoff

Is there a list of these new Aires

I'd love to list them on here, they would be useful to other members I'm sure :thumbs:

Geoff, do you think you could refrain from the spurious comments you keep throwing into this forum like "by the way they are looking at brake cleaner as a gas or similar that they knock you out with
all the best geoff"
It may seem amusing to you, to keep throwing unsupported comments in about gassing robberies etc. but some of the readers on here will be fearful of traveling the continental routes because of them.
By all means add evidential material to support whatever you may of heard, but I think you will find that there is None I will be the first to apologise to you should you find anything other than mystery stories totally unsupported by any other evidence.

I think the nearest you can get unless you are a microsoft Autoroute user is http://www.i-campingcar.fr/accueilcartes.htm
Very up to date and free but of course you need to be on line to access it or you could print the pdf file

regarding your comments traveler ha5 think I can do without
a lecture from you on what I write after reading your previous pages on ie being drugged pulling into car parks I
wouldn't comment on anybody

I was not scaremongering, I offered a reasonable scenario for the stories that circulate. I, like you have no evidence of the alleged gassing, the urban myths that surround this subject are constantly regurgitated on various forums and I like many others have a sigh and say "not again" I will not be holding my breath for you or anyone else bringing a meaningful and evidential post to the forums.

What more evidence do you require see my earlier post.. this happened to me and i given a full explanation of how it happened and what the police said, We were gassed and no doubt about it... have a look at my original post if you can come up with any other reason how 4 fit young men and an 8 year old child did not hear all the chisiling and noise to get into the truck then ransacking it inside and all slept in 3 hours after the alarms went and with stinking sore heads when we did wake up... i would be glad to hear , THIS HAPPENED TO ME not some story thats circulating!!! I am happy to give my phone number and address if anyone wants to contact me.

I only posted this to make people aware of what genuinely happened to us in the hope they may benefit from our experience , Since that happened we have traveled all of Europe a few times and not had a single problem... because we are now more aware and more careful where we park up for the night.

WE had camperstop book and the Aires book but nothing in them, We stayed at a 4 Euro Air at Alvor great spot close to restaurants and the beach, Another was near Salvados agian not far from the beach but no shops around.. very quite.. great.

I agree with you re the campsites.. hate most of them , WE golfed for 6 weeks at Estapona golf club and the owners let us park up in the golf club car park so used there facilities etc.. fantastic.
Roll on November so we can get away agian.
Cheers
Gordon

Gordon please do not think I dispute the fact that you, your son and the others you traveled with suffered the break in to your van you describe. I know you said your son ate a McDonalds and none of the others had any food or drink from there or anywhere else. I am not convinced that the Spanish police who offer gassing as an explanation to the events are a reliable source. They are presented with a set of circumstances and explanations of victims actions and make a somewhat uneducated guess at gassing. Evidence!! who needs it for a therory? Is there ever any attempt made to charge and convict anyone of this much more serious charge of an offence that in this country would attract a maximum penalty of life imprisonment?
Then there are the humourist reports like "thanks iandsm for your interest your question was what's evidence that they used gas. he's still got the dent in his head where the gas bottle hit him" cheers gdz
What can you make of that, was the complete report humour or just the last comment?
In the meantime we wait for the Spanish Police to piece together the facts they collect in relation to these incidents, present it and get a conviction; Then we will have what you could loosely term evidence.

I enquired with my Dentist today, well the best you can with a mouth full of fingers. Whilst he no longer administers gas himself, he did receive training when it used to be permitted. His answer was "To fill an area the size of a van with the quantity of gas to knock out several adults any children in that area would receive a massive overdose which would probably be fatal for them. It would probably be fatal for all of them present if it was a quantity to keep them under for four or five hours given in one dose."